Comments on: Understanding the Bible — or not http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/ Looking with non-artificial intelligence Fri, 21 Nov 2008 21:27:08 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.2 By: WCB http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-279 WCB Wed, 23 Jul 2008 23:25:39 +0000 http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-279 An important question - when all was said and done, was all really said, and equally important done? Did we follow through on our words? Did we serve. FWIW, I appreciate the quotes and insights that you bring to these posts. However, I am more interested in what you think. An important question - when all was said and done, was all really said, and equally important done? Did we follow through on our words? Did we serve.

FWIW, I appreciate the quotes and insights that you bring to these posts. However, I am more interested in what you think.

]]> By: Vivian http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-278 Vivian Wed, 23 Jul 2008 19:49:08 +0000 http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-278 Christians are to love God and love others, and 1 John 3:17-18 says, "If anyone has material possessions and sees his brother in need but has no pity on him, how can the love of God be in him? Dear children, let us not love with words or tongue but with actions and in truth." So certainly the ivory tower is not the way to go, but I don't think an occasional service project is going to cut it either. We need to cultivate an attitude, a lifestyle of service. Susan, and Claiborne in his book, both referred to Mt. 25:31-46, and as Claiborne said, "I could not help but ask, When all is said and done and the thousands of Christians I was with are gathered before the throne, will we all be with the sheep?" (Sorry, Bill, but I only quote what resonates with me. But perhaps I feel another post coming on...) Christians are to love God and love others, and 1 John 3:17-18 says, “If anyone has material possessions and sees his brother in need but has no pity on him, how can the love of God be in him? Dear children, let us not love with words or tongue but with actions and in truth.”

So certainly the ivory tower is not the way to go, but I don’t think an occasional service project is going to cut it either. We need to cultivate an attitude, a lifestyle of service.

Susan, and Claiborne in his book, both referred to Mt. 25:31-46, and as Claiborne said, “I could not help but ask, When all is said and done and the thousands of Christians I was with are gathered before the throne, will we all be with the sheep?”

(Sorry, Bill, but I only quote what resonates with me. But perhaps I feel another post coming on…)

]]> By: WCB http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-277 WCB Wed, 23 Jul 2008 16:13:07 +0000 http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-277 But what does Vivian say? But what does Vivian say?

]]> By: Vivian http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-275 Vivian Tue, 22 Jul 2008 16:15:00 +0000 http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-275 Regarding study vs. service, Claiborne says, "We can admire and worship Jesus without doing what he did. We can applaud what he preached and stood for without caring about the same things. We can adore his cross without taking up ours. I had come to see that the great tragedy in the church is not that rich Christians do not care about the poor but that rich Christians do not know the poor.... I truly believe that when the poor meet the rich, riches will have no meaning. And when the rich meet the poor, we will see poverty come to an end." Regarding study vs. service, Claiborne says,

“We can admire and worship Jesus without doing what he did. We can applaud what he preached and stood for without caring about the same things. We can adore his cross without taking up ours. I had come to see that the great tragedy in the church is not that rich Christians do not care about the poor but that rich Christians do not know the poor…. I truly believe that when the poor meet the rich, riches will have no meaning. And when the rich meet the poor, we will see poverty come to an end.”

]]> By: WCB http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-271 WCB Tue, 22 Jul 2008 12:50:23 +0000 http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-271 I wish I were smart enough, or is it scholarly enough, to quote Kierkegaard. Or do I? Nah....Twain? Yeah, I know him. And the Bill fellow sounds like a reasonable sort to me. I like him. I think it was Abe (that, Abe) who said (and if he didn't say it he should have, and if he didn't want to say it, then I will) 'If men and women are going to read all the books in the world to gain wisdom, they ought to start with the Bible to be sure they get what is most important.' And, I love that Kirky quote. I wish I had said that. Vivian, can you introduce me to that Bill fellow sometime? I wish I were smart enough, or is it scholarly enough, to quote Kierkegaard. Or do I? Nah….Twain? Yeah, I know him. And the Bill fellow sounds like a reasonable sort to me. I like him.

I think it was Abe (that, Abe) who said (and if he didn’t say it he should have, and if he didn’t want to say it, then I will) ‘If men and women are going to read all the books in the world to gain wisdom, they ought to start with the Bible to be sure they get what is most important.’

And, I love that Kirky quote. I wish I had said that.

Vivian, can you introduce me to that Bill fellow sometime?

]]> By: Susan http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-269 Susan Tue, 22 Jul 2008 06:09:32 +0000 http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-269 Mike, that's a good question, and I wish we did more service projects. The practical reality is that service is usually messy and harder to constrain to the one hour we allot for classtime. The churches I know that engage in regular, meaningful acts of service do it on weekends or other times. I see God displaying more fury over people who are spiritual introverts, pondering his word so intently and keeping his law so perfectly that they walk right by the wounded man on the side of the road. I feel more and more that that is the situation I'm in, and it makes me want to respond, "Enough with the spiritual growth! I am absurdly fat and lazy with the amount of it hanging off of me. It's time to go and work it off by showing love in the concrete ways Jesus demanded: <a href="http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%2025:31-46;&version=31;" rel="nofollow">feed the hungry, show hospitality to strangers, visit the prisoners, clothe the needy, and tend the sick</a>." Mike, that’s a good question, and I wish we did more service projects. The practical reality is that service is usually messy and harder to constrain to the one hour we allot for classtime. The churches I know that engage in regular, meaningful acts of service do it on weekends or other times.

I see God displaying more fury over people who are spiritual introverts, pondering his word so intently and keeping his law so perfectly that they walk right by the wounded man on the side of the road. I feel more and more that that is the situation I’m in, and it makes me want to respond, “Enough with the spiritual growth! I am absurdly fat and lazy with the amount of it hanging off of me. It’s time to go and work it off by showing love in the concrete ways Jesus demanded: feed the hungry, show hospitality to strangers, visit the prisoners, clothe the needy, and tend the sick.”

]]> By: Lewis http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-266 Lewis Tue, 22 Jul 2008 04:19:05 +0000 http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-266 So when you say "he reminds me of our friend Bill," I assume you are referring to the beginning of the Kierkegaard quote, the part that says "The Bible is very easy to understand," and not to the fact that Claiborne quoted Kierkegaard -- something Bill would never do, at least on purpose. <grin> Bill is much more likely to quote (and has quoted) Mark Twain, who famously said, "It ain't those parts of the Bible that I can't understand that bother me, it is the parts I do understand." The reality is, as Kiergegaard, Twain, (apparently) Claiborne, and Bill all basically say, we understand far more of God's word than we act on. And, as you eloquently wrote, there are things in the Bible we therefore don't want to "understand." Those before us (see Hebrews 11, as well as Kiergegaard, Chambers, Nouwen, etc.), and those around us who have lived out their faith, even if imperfectly or incompletely, are examples to us all to grow in our own "understanding." So when you say “he reminds me of our friend Bill,” I assume you are referring to the beginning of the Kierkegaard quote, the part that says “The Bible is very easy to understand,” and not to the fact that Claiborne quoted Kierkegaard — something Bill would never do, at least on purpose.

Bill is much more likely to quote (and has quoted) Mark Twain, who famously said, “It ain’t those parts of the Bible that I can’t understand that bother me, it is the parts I do understand.” The reality is, as Kiergegaard, Twain, (apparently) Claiborne, and Bill all basically say, we understand far more of God’s word than we act on.

And, as you eloquently wrote, there are things in the Bible we therefore don’t want to “understand.”

Those before us (see Hebrews 11, as well as Kiergegaard, Chambers, Nouwen, etc.), and those around us who have lived out their faith, even if imperfectly or incompletely, are examples to us all to grow in our own “understanding.”

]]> By: Mike G http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-265 Mike G Tue, 22 Jul 2008 02:07:56 +0000 http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-265 I wonder sometimes about our Bible classes. We occasionally skip a Bible class (one of two per week) and do something service oriented -- but never for very many weeks in a row. Would I grow more spiritually on a given week serving those God loves or reading his word? Would God be pleased with such activity? I wonder sometimes about our Bible classes. We occasionally skip a Bible class (one of two per week) and do something service oriented — but never for very many weeks in a row. Would I grow more spiritually on a given week serving those God loves or reading his word? Would God be pleased with such activity?

]]> By: Susan http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-263 Susan Mon, 21 Jul 2008 23:18:18 +0000 http://www.pacc.org/blog/2008/07/21/understanding-the-bible-or-not/#comment-263 Great post, Vivian. After reading this post and quote, I've got at least ten thoughts running through my brain and fighting to get out first. So where to start? Chronologically? Y'know, I have so much to say that I think I'd better just create a new post. I love your punchline! Great post, Vivian. After reading this post and quote, I’ve got at least ten thoughts running through my brain and fighting to get out first. So where to start? Chronologically? Y’know, I have so much to say that I think I’d better just create a new post.

I love your punchline!

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